Jorginho was the first world-class Brazilian to represent Bayern. His life's journey from a favela in Rio de Janeiro to World Cup glory shows that football is more than just a game. Shortly before his 60th birthday, he told members' magazine ‘51’ how Germany and Franz Beckenbauer shaped him forever.
Interview with Jorginho
Jorginho, many Bayern fans still remember how you celebrated a goal in May 1994 in memory of the recently deceased Formula 1 world champion Ayrton Senna. Was that spontaneous?
Jorginho: “I was very moved by Senna's death. He was a huge idol for us Brazilians. But of course I didn't expect to score a goal in that game against Schalke. I was more of a provider. I crossed more than I scored. But then a blocked shot from Bruno Labbadia landed right at my feet. I didn't think twice. I shot straight away with my weaker left foot. It was great. The ball went right in the corner. I immediately thought of Ayrton Senna and celebrated in his honour.”
What images do you have in your head when you think of Bayern?
“The first thing I think of is Franz Beckenbauer. He was only my coach in the second half of the 1993/94 season, but it was an unforgettable time. Everything changed completely with him. The atmosphere in the dressing room was suddenly much more relaxed and we simply played football. When I look back on my two and a half years at Bayern, I think above all of the six months with Beckenbauer.”
Your time at Bayern came to an end almost 30 years ago. What connection do you still have to Munich today?
“Just last year, I spent two weeks in Munich with my wife. The connection is always there, also because of the Stars4Kids Foundation, which I co-founded. Bayern and many other German clubs are very supportive of our work. I always say Germany is my second home.”
Do you still have lederhosen at home in Rio de Janeiro?
(laughs) “No, but I have a photo of myself in lederhosen. That's also a great memory. It was very strange at first, but then I felt very comfortable in lederhosen.”
„As a coach, it's important to me to give my players something beyond the pitch, for life.”
Jorginho
You still speak very good German.
“Learning German was important to me. Also to get to know the culture. I learnt a lot in Germany, also because I wasn't just with my teammates, but with lots of ‘normal’ people. I was in their homes, learnt how they live, what they think, what they eat. That made my life very rich. I find it impressive how the Germans rebuilt their country after the war. This mentality is also reflected in football. I played with Brazil against Germany in 1993. We were leading 3-0 at half-time and ended up drawing 3-3. That's Germany.”
You grew up in difficult circumstances in Rio de Janeiro. Do you sometimes marvel at what football has done to your life?
“I owe everything I am today to football. I had great success as a player and as a coach. But football has shown me that winning isn't everything. As a coach, it's important to me to give my players something beyond the pitch, for life. Just like Beckenbauer did for me. Sometimes he just took you in his arms and asked: ‘What do you think? What do you need?’ Behind every player is a person – I learnt that from Beckenbauer. He left his mark on my life. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to visit him before he died. Only sometimes Franz could be tough.”
Like when?
“Before that game against Schalke, for example. He was really angry with me because I had travelled to Brazil for an international match a few days earlier. He wanted me to stay in Munich. I came back on Friday evening totally tired and on Saturday he put me on the bench. He only subbed me on because Dieter Frey got injured after 20 minutes - and I scored the best goal of my career.”
„As a player, I was always one of the best in terms of fitness. Only at Bayern was it sometimes too much for me too.”
Jorginho
What would have happened to you without football?
“My father died when I was 10 years old, one of my brothers was an alcoholic, another was a drug addict. I also did a lot of things in my youth that weren't right. For example, I started smoking at the age of 15 and stopped again at 17. I remember on the Tuesday after carnival, I told my then girlfriend and now wife that I would never touch a cigarette again, because I wanted to be a footballer. Later, as a player, I was always one of the best in terms of fitness. Only at Bayern was it sometimes too much for me too.”
Why?
“Erich Ribbeck always made us run the day after a game, one kilometre in five minutes. I said: ‘Coach, I can't run that fast. I ran a lot yesterday and I'm totally knackered.’ But it didn't help, it was hard back then. But football taught me discipline. Also diligence, that I have to respect others, that you can't just win, that you have to keep going even after a defeat. That's exactly what we're trying to teach children and young people with my foundation in Rio de Janeiro.”
„Football is a means of education for us, not a business. We’re not a player agent. We want to develop people, not footballers.”
Jorginho
Your foundation runs an education centre in Guadalupe, the district where you grew up.
“It's called ‘Bola pra frente’, in English it means ‘forward with the ball’. That's what we say in Brazil, it means: ‘Look ahead and keep going!’ We look after 500 children aged six to 17 and they take part in various classes. And those who can't find work can continue their education with us. We don't lose anyone to drugs or crime who comes to us for a long time. I myself lost many friends at a very young age, so this is really a project close to my heart.”
They surely also play football, right?
“Of course. But football is a means of education for us, not a business. We’re not a player agent. We want to develop people, not footballers.”
You'll be 60 in mid-August. How do you see the future?
“I don't see myself retiring for a long time yet. I want to continue working as a coach. I was last at Buriram in Thailand and won the league there. I'm fit and still have dreams of being a coach in Germany one day, for example.”
You can read the extended interview in the latest issue of members’ magazine ‘51’