Thomas Müller farewell interview: 'I knew I was good - but not how far it would take me'

Record appearance maker, record winner, Bavarian – after 25 years it's time to say goodbye to our number 25. But FC Bayern club magazine '51' couldn't let Thomas Müller go without speaking with him at length one more time. Once again, ‘Radio Pähl’ demonstrates he has an unmatched instinct for spaces and words.

Thomas Müller interview

Thomas, we want to look back on your 25 years at FC Bayern. And specifically using comments that you have made in the course of your career – or that others have made about you.
Thomas Müller: “Oh, there’s obviously a lot of material there.”

Let’s start: “I guarantee nothing – except: he’ll score goals, goals, goals!”
“I know that one of course. Hermann Gerland said that.”

With those words in Uli Hoeneß’s office he fought against your sale to Hoffenheim. How would your career have turned out otherwise?
“At that time, in January 2009, I actually wanted out. Hoffenheim were at the top of the table with Bayern, and I would’ve been the fifth attacker for four positions there. At Bayern, on the other hand, I’d only played in the third division at that point and wasn’t even training with the first team. So, at first I wasn’t exactly thrilled that the move didn’t happen. Now I obviously know: it was fine that way (laughs).”

So we should thank Hermann Gerland that you stayed with us. How’s your relationship today?
“The ‘Tiger’ and I developed a relationship that goes way beyond football. We know and respect each other, also our manner, our directness. I’ve been thinking about the topic of gratitude a lot recently. Obviously there are lots of coaches and people who I have to thank, like Hermann Gerland for example. Or also Louis van Gaal – I’m glad I had the pleasure of playing and training under him. But you could say there were also good reasons why I played a lot under him. He tried various configurations back then and it worked best with me.”

You convinced with your performance then.
“Exactly. Hermann Gerland also championed me because I was valuable to his team. In professional sport it’s first and foremost about performance, not about goodwill. I sometimes find this principle lacking at social level. I’d like everyone to have the same starting chances in our society – but after that, everyone is allowed to move forward through performance instead of relying on others. I feel that’s been lost a bit.”

The next quote: “I know that every goal counts the same, namely one. I also know that if you only take the nice goals, I wouldn’t have so many to my name.” Which of your 248 Bayern goals would you nevertheless pick out?
“The most memorable experience was my goal in the ‘Finale dahoam’, because it was a moment of redemption and the whole city shook afterwards. There were also a lot of emotions at play when I scored the equaliser in the last minute against Juventus in the 2016 Champions League last-16 second leg. At the end of the day, though, it doesn’t matter how beautiful a goal is, but more what it triggers in your mind in that moment. And that cocktail of chemicals is obviously strengthened in direct proportion by the reaction of the crowd. That intensity is what stays in the memory.”

“Goals are not my fuel. They’re more the varnish. The special varnish for the car that looks good on the outside.”
“By that I was trying to say: if you score a goal, it normally masks your actual performance. Obviously as an attacker, you’re judged on goals. But I’ve always defined myself differently, as a team player. When I run at the goalkeeper in a two-on-one situation, I always play the square pass because that maximises the probability of a goal.”

If it wasn’t the goals, what has been your fuel over all the years?
“My drive has always been competition. And I’ve had that at Bayern at the highest level and under the biggest possible glare in Germany. It goes back to the happiness hormones, with the public pressure as a multiplier. 75,000 spectators at the Allianz Arena, 400,000 club members – and around 80 million Germans at the World Cup.”

You said: “I’m a Raumdeuter.” This has become a specialised term for your style of play.
“I used that term off the cuff in an interview. It was always said that people couldn’t understand how I can perform at this top level. I’m apparently too slow, can’t dribble and so on. With ‘Raumdeuter’ I tried to explain what my essential strength is, that I’m someone who’s good off the ball. The term stuck, even abroad (laughs).”

So what defines the Raumdeuter?
“Jamal Musiala runs with the ball into five opposition players and comes out still with the ball – I don’t. I need team-mates, I operate by means of space, positioning, link-up play. I try to create brief moments of uncertainty in the defenders – who’s responsible for me right now? Then I exploit that. Contrary to popular opinion, my game is actually completely predictable. The coaches who gave a lot of structure were always better for my game.”

Did you ever think: all the players at Bayern have something I don’t – why am I here?
“Initially yes. I always knew I was good - but not how far it would take me. When Pep Guardiola came in, it was clear to me I’m not the typical Pep player. Nevertheless, I was the one with the most games in those three years, I think even with the most goals. That’s when I realised that I also have something that others don’t. Eventually you believe it.”

You said about the title celebrations in 2018: “Just like when you get promoted in the district league, only perhaps a little more subdued.”
“Don’t worry, we celebrated well back then, but we also knew we still had the DFB Cup final a week later. That’s why you have to put the brakes on. After a proper district-league title celebration, I doubt anyone can train properly for the next three days.”

Is that perhaps the biggest disadvantage of playing at the highest level – that you don’t get much chance to savour successes because the next title is calling straight away?
“You think that sometimes, but actually I find it nice that it continues all the time. The competition, the journey to the title are what make it fun. Winning the trophy at the end is just a nice moment that rounds off the season – and then it goes on.”

Your greatest defeat was the ‘Finale dahoam’. Is that the one match you’d like to play again?
“The ‘Finale dahoam’ was the most extreme individual moment of my career, but I wouldn’t want to play it again because then I might not have that moment anymore. And there’s also something appealing about knowing that matches aren't just replayable, that things don’t come again. Thanks to our exploits in the following season, we can thankfully look back on the ‘Finale dahoam’ a bit more mercifully now.”

You signed off your farewell letter to the fans with “Forever forward, FC Bayern” – the title of the new anthem. Does that stay with you?
“I think the anthem’s cool, it hits the nail on the head. As a fan, of course, you want FC Bayern to continue having success. I always find it amazing that this club not only arouses so much emotion, but also unites so many people: with its football, with its values and also with its social responsibility. Obviously there are always things that are discussed critically, but as a whole construct FC Bayern is a hugely positive brand.”

You’ve always had a special connection to the fans. What does that mean to you after this long time?
“The fans are part of the fascination of football. We’ve had a lot of shared moments, hard defeats and great wins, which we’ve all felt. You might think that football, with its 90 minutes of play and sometimes only one goal or none at all, should be the Valium of modern times. But it’s not like that. The match, the rivalry between the teams, the different countries – all of that still enthrals us.”

The full interview will be published in the June/July edition of ‘51’ (in German).